MKV Toyota Supra said to start at $63.5k in US with BMW B58 motor

[Sticky]

$64,500 puts the new MKV Toyota Supra in Porsche 718 S territory although Porsche options sure add up in a hurry. The price makes sense and would be worth it if the MKV Supra in US trim ended up being what was rumored a little while back.

Instead, this is supposedly the spec:

• 3.0l Turbo I6, 335hp/369lb-ft
• 0-60: 4.5 seconds
• ~3300 lbs
• ~$63.5K USD MSRP
• Heads-up Display, Lane assist, Pre-Collision warning, Navigation, Parking assist, etc as standard.
• Our rendered images are fairly accurate to the real car. Small details are different.
• Side mirrors are the BMW-esque 3-series takeoffs that we all complained about, blacked out.
• New Supra badge.
• Grey and Red "GR" badge on rear of car.
• Body fender “vents” are fake, both front and rear.
• Interior is objectively quite nice:
• Seats are black leather sports seat. Nice stitching and accents.
• High-quality materials. Nice plastics. Lexus level quality
• Center console has a BMW-style screen with iDrive. UI is reskinned slightly.
• Instrument cluster is fully digital. Physical readouts flank the screen around it
• Radio/HVAC controls similar to BMW, but separated into two separate stacks.
• Steering wheel is standard BMW wheel with Toyota logo.
• HVAC vents are nice, thin like newer Lexuses with a splash of chrome.
• Overall dashboard is a good look, quality interior. Shape and style is different to Z4.
• The auto shifter looks similar to BMW.
• Standard iDrive controls left of the shifter.
• Overall interior is bespoke, not the same as Z4, more sporty. But shares some switchgear.
• The car has a Heads Up Display
• There is a rear strut bar in brushed aluminum.

That is... underwhelming. 3300 pounds is too much weight and 335 horsepower means Toyota is not tweaking the powerplant. Maybe this is just the base version?

Either way enough of these forum rumors. Nobody seems to know the truth and every week a new version comes out.

[Stevenh]

Surprise surprise. 10% over promised weight. No thanks.

[Enfiftyfore]

I was interested at $55k with a possibly new motor. No longer interested at $63.5k for a B58 (edit:With fake $#@!ing vents... what is this, a Mustang?). What a joke.

[Alpina_B3_Lux]

It's too heavy indeed, but well BMW is incapable of developing anything lightweight from what we have seen in the past 15 years.

I'm not surprised at the powerplant, it was never realistic to expect a new engine to be developed for such a low volume model. That is simply not doable any longer from an economical perspective. But indeed, they could at least have tweaked it a bit instead of just putting the 340i engine in there.

[Sticky]

It's too heavy indeed, but well BMW is incapable of developing anything lightweight from what we have seen in the past 15 years.

I'm not surprised at the powerplant, it was never realistic to expect a new engine to be developed for such a low volume model. That is simply not doable any longer from an economical perspective. But indeed, they could at least have tweaked it a bit instead of just putting the 340i engine in there.

It could still be the base spec but honestly I don't know.

Maybe the info is all wrong but sub 3000 pounds with 400 horses at $55k sounded too good to be true anyway.

[BlackJetE90OC]

Surprise surprise. 10% over promised weight. No thanks.

Who promised that?

[BlackJetE90OC]

It could still be the base spec but honestly I don't know.

Maybe the info is all wrong but sub 3000 pounds with 400 horses at $55k sounded too good to be true anyway.

From a couple insiders, the increase in estimated price and weight is likely correct. New Z4 weight(1500kg) minus 50-100lbs. The hp rating is on the low side, they are estimating 380hp now. The new Z4 M40i has 340hp, so I don't see the Supra having less than it.

Supposedly the current test mule weighs 3050lbs. Sometime recently Toyota USA had their way and is requesting the car come standard with all that equipment(adding weight). Essentially asking for a higher end car, rather than a back to basics sports car.

[BlackJetE90OC]

A quote from one of the two sources a lot of these rumors come from:

part of my issue with this, aside from other parts, is the output and how its using B58 numbers as said. the new engine in the Supra uses an iron block and a new head and apparently has been tested to reliably hold 700hp. This was the design requirement Toyota issued to BMW; ensure the motor can handle extreme tuning (well, extreme in their eyes).

[Sticky]

Essentially asking for a higher end car, rather than a back to basics sports car.

What's the point? A Z4 already exists. Differentiate this.

[Sticky]

A quote from one of the two sources a lot of these rumors come from:

I don't buy the iron block.

[IllSic_Design]

Guy who works for Toyota and posted this info on the supra forums confirmed today(and was NOT very happy to say) that the weight and price are increased and close to what was quoted above. I figured the weight would be around there but surprised by the increase in price. Sucks for Supra enthusiasts

[Sticky]

Guy who works for Toyota and posted this info on the supra forums confirmed today(and was NOT very happy to say) that the weight and price are increased and close to what was quoted above. I figured the weight would be around there but surprised by the increase in price. Sucks for Supra enthusiasts

It still would be cheaper in 2018 dollars than what the MKIV Supra cost so no reason to bitch about the price.

I'd be pissed about the weight after hearing 3000 pounds.

Why are so few willing to go lighter rather than just add power?

[Bowser330]

It still would be cheaper in 2018 dollars than what the MKIV Supra cost so no reason to $#@! about the price.

I'd be pissed about the weight after hearing 3000 pounds.

Why are so few willing to go lighter rather than just add power?

i would say safety regulations make it harder to go lighter but then again there is the....

MX5/Fiat Spider = 23XXlbs
FRS/BRZ = 27XXlbs
911 = 32XXlbs (base)

but if you are going to add weight...then add the damn power!

[IllSic_Design]

US version will most likely have around 380hp, which is what the latest b58 is supposed to put out.

[Sticky]

The B58 will have no trouble making 380, 480, or even 580. The S58 will easily prove that.

[BLKROKT]

This car is going to be an utter embarrassment to the Supra name. The specs look more like a GT86 on modest steroids than anything.

The fanboi JDM crowd will love sticking all kinds of wings and vents and stickers on it though and make them look like Fast n Furious set props. That’s all they’ll be good for since performance doesn’t look like it factored in the development.

[BlackJetE90OC]

If some people are expecting a big horsepower straight line or drag car, they need to change their expectations. Their intent is to build a sports car. Think of it as Toyota is building the next gen Z4 M coupe.

[Sticky]

Their intent is to build a sports car.

But it's increasingly looking like it will be heavier and offer less power than rumored.

Plus if there is no manual...

[BlackJetE90OC]

But it's increasingly looking like it will be heavier and offer less power than rumored.

Plus if there is no manual...

Let’s say it does come in at the rumored 50-100lbs lighter than the next gen Z4(3,300). At 3,250lbs with 380hp, that puts it at slightly better power to weight ratio than a Cayman S. With more tuning potential. Combine that with BMW chassis perfected by the same individuals who worked on the superb handling GT86. This could be a winner. But it is a different car than the last Supra, which was more a GT car with mega tuning potential. Manual hasn’t been ruled out, they will gauge customer feedback. I see it eventually happening.

[Sticky2]

Well let's keep it positive and maybe it will be a nice surprise.

[BlackJetE90OC]

Trying. Only problem I see is the price estimate. It is far too high. The car needs Cayman S or better performance for a minimum $10k less msrp.

[BlackJetE90OC]

Some current news. Straight from Tetsuya Tada at the Le Mans

The new Supra will be a “pure sports car”

The Supra and new BMW Z4 will share a straight-six engine and gearbox, but they aren’t near-identical twins like the GT86 and Subaru BRZ. “Each company defined what we wanted and went from there,” explains Tada. “Both cars have completely different suspension and software calibration, for example.”

Tada insists the Supra “will be a pure sports car – practicality and comfort were almost not considered.”

A hot Supra GRMN is coming, too
Following the critically-acclaimed Yaris GRMN hot hatch, will we see a hotter, GRMN-badged version of the Supra? Certainly not at launch, it seems, but Tada doesn’t deny the car is in development.

“I would like to see something like that eventually,” he smiles. “We are preparing for it”.

The Supra isn’t the only famous Toyota nameplate that could make a comeback. Tada grins when quizzed about a possible return for the Celica and MR2: “I’m often asked that, and we get many requests."

“We’re committed to sports cars and Gazoo Racing means we have more resources for developing them. We’ll investigate what cars to introduce in-future, but this company set-up shows where we want to go.”

[Sticky]

Some current news. Straight from Tetsuya Tada at the Le Mans

Sounds like he says they are the same thing except for the software calibration and suspension.

[BlackJetE90OC]

Sounds like he says they are the same thing except for the software calibration and suspension.

True statement if you believe the 1M and 135i are the same car. I’ve said it a couple times, but it’s seems like Toyota is building the Z4 M coupe many people have been asking for a return of.

[Sticky]

True statement if you believe the 1M and 135i are the same car. I’ve said it a couple times, but it’s seems like Toyota is building the Z4 M coupe many people have been asking for a return of.

We'll see but he does not differentiate too much there. He admits it is basically the same motor and trans with some different software. That's lame.