RB turbo question possible problem.

[bobS]

I just want someone to get to the bottom of this smoking issue, bc it's keeping me from pulling the trigger on rb's. I wonder if I could run AR high flow catted dp's with rb's if I ended up having some smoke on deceleration.....hmm

My car has had puffs of smoke here and there but it seems to have gone away since I had my valves cleaned.

[bobS]

I just want someone to get to the bottom of this smoking issue, bc it's keeping me from pulling the trigger on rb's. I wonder if I could run AR high flow catted dp's with rb's if I ended up having some smoke on deceleration.....hmm

My car has had puffs of smoke here and there but it seems to have gone away since I had my valves cleaned.

[LostMarine]

theres no easy or concrete answer as all of us had smoke for different reasons. All i can say is that if its a bad turbo, you wont have to ask

[Sticky]

BTW Vargas. I believe the dyno was done at 15psi not 18psi with those numbers!!

I can't believe how people are starting to spin this. My brother has been working with Vargas daily. Everyone needs to chill.
I just finished as a mechanical engineer. I know too many people like Rob. They work in an industry for a short time and suddenly see themselves as experts. Time and time again the best engineers are the ones that approach a problem with an open mind. They try until finally they are satisfied. Although I just started my career, I have grown up watching my father go through the R&D process with his business. The speed that Vargas is moving at is shockingly fast for such a complex component.

Well said.

[Sticky]

theres no easy or concrete answer as all of us had smoke for different reasons. All i can say is that if its a bad turbo, you wont have to ask

So it is pretty prevalent then.

[Rob@RBTurbo]

It has now been established that 8 years of firsthand experience, hundreds and hundreds of hours into builds, hundreds of turbochargers sold in the performance market, hundreds of hours into R&D into this very platform, hundreds of cars out everyday religiously pushing the envelope, are all completely meaningless as RB is a fly by night idiot.

As said earlier, no one knows anyone here. I am sure no one here would come off like they do hiding behind their keyboard to the others face. It has been said MANY of times, release a product and let it do the talking; then the consumer can decide.

Happy Veterans day.

Rob

[Sticky]

So basically don't cover the process, don't announce your product, don't provide info, and don't do anything until the product is released.

Yet... you are talking in Vargas threads. Yet... you announced your product before it came to market. Just because cars are running your turbos now because you happened to be on the market first doesn't mean other people can't discuss and announce their products.

Why people are punishing someone for coming to market I have no clue. Not like they can go back in time and release something earlier.

hundreds of cars out everyday religiously pushing the envelope

Hundreds of cars? LOL.

[DBFIU]

BTW Vargas. I believe the dyno was done at 15psi not 18psi with those numbers!!

I can't believe how people are starting to spin this. My brother has been working with Vargas daily. Everyone needs to chill.
I just finished as a mechanical engineer. I know too many people like Rob. They work in an industry for a short time and suddenly see themselves as experts. Time and time again the best engineers are the ones that approach a problem with an open mind. They try until finally they are satisfied. Although I just started my career, I have grown up watching my father go through the R&D process with his business. The speed that Vargas is moving at is shockingly fast for such a complex component.

Do you know Rob personally?

[Tony@VargasTurboTech]

Do you know Rob personally?

I don't belive he does and your point begs the obvious question. Do any of you who are so quick to attack, know me personally? I really do not want, nor think its healthy for the community for a back and forth between me and Rob. I believe the market has room for some competition and I offer an apology for getting caught up in the BS. When my product starts testing which will be very soon the proof will be in the pudding. Ok back to football.

[DBFIU]

I don't belive he does and your point begs the obvious question. Do any of you who are so quick to attack, know me personally? I really do not want, nor think its healthy for the community for a back and forth between me and Rob. I believe the market has room for some competition and I offer an apology for getting caught up in the BS. When my product starts testing which will be very soon the proof will be in the pudding. Ok back to football.

No one is attacking you, we just want to see your product finished before comparing it to someone else's. If you succeed, and I hope you do, then you have every right to claim your accomplishment, rightfully so.


Tony, you have to understand where we are coming from. A lot of people, I mean A LOT, of people; have tried to build production turbo upgrades for this engine and have failed miserably. All the way back when Vishnu started, to ASR, even to big singles like unfor (Sticky remembers that joker with the fake dyno graphs), we are very used to seeing people come on here and say "we're gonna do this and that and it's gonna be awesome" just to be let down. I understand you have ambition in succeeding in doing the upgrade, but just know that many people have tried and failed miserably; except Rob who has successfully produced a production level kit that has become very popular.

I don't know what the beef is between you 2 nor do I care, but I give respect where it is due, and it is fair for me to give it to Rob because he started out with the ambition of making a turbo upgrade for the N54 and succeeded where a lot have failed. Whether or not the kit was an easy "MHI ez turbo" swap doesn't matter, the fact remains he deserves some level of respect, at least from me.

When you complete your product, at that point we can judge, until then you must reserve at least 'some' respect for Robs product even though yours in the future may be better.

[Tony@VargasTurboTech]

No one is attacking you, we just want to see your product finished before comparing it to someone else's. If you succeed, and I hope you do, then you have every right to claim your accomplishment, rightfully so.


Tony, you have to understand where we are coming from. A lot of people, I mean A LOT, of people; have tried to build production turbo upgrades for this engine and have failed miserably. All the way back when Vishnu started, to ASR, even to big singles like unfor (Sticky remembers that joker with the fake dyno graphs), we are very used to seeing people come on here and say "we're gonna do this and that and it's gonna be awesome" just to be let down. I understand you have ambition in succeeding in doing the upgrade, but just know that many people have tried and failed miserably; except Rob who has successfully produced a production level kit that has become very popular.

I don't know what the beef is between you 2 nor do I care, but I give respect where it is due, and it is fair for me to give it to Rob because he started out with the ambition of making a turbo upgrade for the N54 and succeeded where a lot have failed. Whether or not the kit was an easy "MHI ez turbo" swap doesn't matter, the fact remains he deserves some level of respect, at least from me.

When you complete your product, at that point we can judge, until then you must reserve at least 'some' respect for Robs product even though yours in the future may be better.

Couldn't agree more and honestly, I felt like I gave Rob plenty of respect when I first got here and he started off cool. Next thing I know he is bashing me, then being friendly again. I have nothing against him and respect what he did, so I was a little confused by this. Our goals are to bring turbos to the market that perform as well, while at the same time trying to address some of the known issues with the oiling if possible. We are not too far out from testing. So we will not have to wait too much longer to see the results. I am very confident they will perform as I hope, but I understand the skepticism due to the history of this platform. I honestly hope we can just end this bickering and move on.

[LostMarine]

So it is pretty prevalent then.

really reaching here.. N54s smoking is prevelent yes. if its a turbo, you will know its a turbo

when my stock turbos went, it was only SLIGHTLY less than this:

[Sticky]

No one is attacking you, we just want to see your product finished before comparing it to someone else's. If you succeed, and I hope you do, then you have every right to claim your accomplishment, rightfully so.

Rob attacked him.


Secondly, is he not supposed to say he is working on something? Only thing to discuss is once it's done and out? Did Rob do that? Does anyone do that?

[Sticky]

really reaching here.. N54s smoking is prevelent yes. if its a turbo, you will know its a turbo when my stock turbos went, it was only SLIGHTLY less than this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-wXH9ScKIgI

I'm speaking strictly to the RB turbos. Smoking is prevalent and a constant topic regarding them. Whatever the reason may be, it's not made up.

[LostMarine]

ok, aaaand? smoking N54s is a constant topic, so until one finds/eliminates every other possible cause, turbos are just one possible cause.

[Autobahn335i]

Having a set of RBs on my shelf waiting for my car to boost again (for effs sake I can't find the issue...) I still wish Vargas the best of luck with his products. From an enthusiasts POV I welcome all R&D which is put into this platform and which will push the envelope further.

[xbox_fan]

I wonder if a pair of high-flow cats would help with this problem ?

If it did it is actually only hiding the problem,or?

[Autobahn335i]

If it did it is actually only hiding the problem,or?

Adding cats adds a bit of backpressure. On some cars this seems to prevent the problem.

[Covfefe]

Adding cats adds a bit of backpressure. On some cars this seems to prevent the problem.

How do you know that? What if the cats filtering the oil out? Please explain to me how an easier evacuation of exhaust gasses can cause a turbo to smoke.

[MDORPHN]

How do you know that? What if the cats filtering the oil out? Please explain to me how an easier evacuation of exhaust gasses can cause a turbo to smoke.

Journal bearings are very sensitive to the relative pressure on the turbine and compressor side. I believe that the theory is that the reduced pressure on the turbine side causes oil to leak through the journal into the exhaust.

Neil

[Covfefe]

Journal bearings are very sensitive to the relative pressure on the turbine and compressor side. I believe that the theory is that the reduced pressure on the turbine side causes oil to leak through the journal into the exhaust.

Neil

Yes, but if they are so sensitive then how can a TD03 model be used on so many different vehicles, surely all its applications have completely varying back pressures, if anything it could be argued more back pressure can cause the oil problem due to the increased load on the engine and the increased difficulty to evacuate exhaust gasses which can result in increased temperatures.

[5soko]

It can be other things then just the turbo. It can be a engine that is a little hungry on oil then other engines... Hard to blame it on the turbos themselves, unless you pin pointed it directly on the turbo. ( i.g. swapped to rb then the smoke started) Ive seen a lot of oil hungry N54 engines, even brand new ones. And the PVC system on this car seems to be sketchy, might lead to some smoke somehow.

[bobS]

It can be other things then just the turbo. It can be a engine that is a little hungry on oil then other engines... Hard to blame it on the turbos themselves, unless you pin pointed it directly on the turbo. ( i.g. swapped to rb then the smoke started) Ive seen a lot of oil hungry N54 engines, even brand new ones. And the PVC system on this car seems to be sketchy, might lead to some smoke somehow.

I've had the smoke here and there....only like 3 times in the 55k miles. My car doesn't consume any oil between changes...

[nafoo]

It has now been established that 8 years of firsthand experience, hundreds and hundreds of hours into builds, hundreds of turbochargers sold in the performance market, hundreds of hours into R&D into this very platform, hundreds of cars out everyday religiously pushing the envelope, are all completely meaningless as RB is a fly by night idiot.

As said earlier, no one knows anyone here. I am sure no one here would come off like they do hiding behind their keyboard to the others face. It has been said MANY of times, release a product and let it do the talking; then the consumer can decide.

Happy Veterans day.

Rob

Hehe, this is one of Rob's nice posts.

Why can't we all just get along?