Study says ethanol harms engines...

[Jeffman]

I'm trying to figure out whether or not to add even more ethanol to my gas. This study suggests that I shouldn't. What do you think? Any evidence specific to the N54 for or against? Thanks.
http://www.greencarreports.com/news/...ker-study-says

[Payam@BMS]

$#@!, and I just switched over to e47 hahah.

[Jeffman]

Sorry. Above link was a news item. Here is a link to the 100+ page technical study. http://www.crcao.com/reports/recents...l%20Report.pdf

[Sticky]

Sorry. Above link was a news item. Here is a link to the 100+ page technical study. http://www.crcao.com/reports/recents...l%20Report.pdf

100 pages? Ugh, this is going to take a while.

Main thing though is making sure your fuel system is E85 compatible and many newer cars are.

[Itsbrokeagain]

apparently from the comments the study was from the American Petroleum Institute. Hmm since Ethanol is usually made from corn, I can see where this is going...a threat to Gasoline companies?

[ajm8127]

apparently from the comments the study was from the American Petroleum Institute. Hmm since Ethanol is usually made from corn, I can see where this is going...a threat to Gasoline companies?

From the CRC "About" page:

"The Sustaining Members of CRC are the American Petroleum Institute (API) and a group of automobile manufacturer members (Chrysler, Ford, General Motors, Honda, Mitsubishi, Nissan, Toyota, and Volkswagen)."

If you read the Executive Summary, it kind of sounds like a mixed bag to me. I wish I knew what Vehicle 8 was. That engine is garbage.

They also tested used cars. I understand this is a representative sample of vehicles which will be using higher ethanol content fuels, but it seems to me that testing used cars leaves the door open to a ton of other variables.

[vladi627]

Fuuuuu, running E50 now, hopefully it's worth the performance trade-off

[alpinedevil335]

So far so good here. 50/50 mix hasn't shown any ill effects YET.

[Jeffman]

I guess we are doing our own study...QUESTION: Has anybody running ethanol/gas fuel mixtures noticed any premature engine wear? E.g., requiring new injectors, engine seals, etc.?I will post this separately. Thanks.

[Sticky]

I guess we are doing our own study...QUESTION: Has anybody running ethanol/gas fuel mixtures noticed any premature engine wear? E.g., requiring new injectors, engine seals, etc.?I will post this separately. Thanks.

Guys here have really only been running it a short while...

[ajm8127]

It would be interesting if some guys running e85 mixes do leak down tests every time they change their plugs.

Every seal or hose touching fuel should be a fluoroelastomer. I wouldn't expect trouble from those parts. It's the valve seats or three way catalysts that I would be worried about if the aforementioned study has any validity. Considering most people running e85 mixes have probably gone sans-catalyst in their down pipes, the valve seats would be the main area of concern to me.

[GetSomeE92]

I sure hope it isn't a problem. I'm going to be out of warranty soon but I really like the performance boost.

[Ak335i]

since the cars been doing so well on an E85 mix I've stepped up the game use it in my lawn mower now, I cut the grass in half the time! All the neighbors are all jelly of my grass cutting one wheel peeler!

[undercoverangie]

I'm trying to figure out whether or not to add even more ethanol to my gas. This study suggests that I shouldn't. What do you think? Any evidence specific to the N54 for or against? Thanks.
http://www.greencarreports.com/news/...ker-study-says

I didn't read anything besides the caption, however, to my knowledge which is backed up by converting dozens upon dozens of cars to ethanol, the only requirement is to make sure that your pump, lines, regulator and o-rings are all ethanol/alcohol compatible. We have yet to have any failure that is ethanol related, nor have we seen any negative effects on valve train, intake track, cylinder wall, pistons or rings.

What we have seen,is on average 200 degree lower EGT's, shiny piston domes and increased life on rings, also lower coolant temps.

In regards to OEM cars having issues with gasoline being cut with 5-15% ethanol, this is true because fuel trims peg. The reason why they peg, if the car was built before the government mandated ethanol into gasoline, and the vehicle had not been re-flashed for this, the engine will run lean. This could most certainly cause engine failure, however, I have yet to see anything besidesP0171/74 codes indicating lean, mixture with all other engine components intact.

If you do what you are supposed to do when using ethanol, there will not be any adverse effects.

People need to refrain from using the terminology PURE E85/70 this is an incorrect statement. There is nothing pure about E85 and if you have an ethanol content sensor and gauge you will quickly learn how off the advertised rating is. Which is a very good reason as to why no car should EVER use ethanol without a sensor.... Your $#@! might blow up!!! ^__^... We have seen swings from E58 in the winter and the best we have seen yet was E80. If I had a customer that wanted every ounce of power and it was tuned for E85 and he went and got fuel that was actually E70, he could essentially kiss his engine goodbye, with an ethanol sensor in place, and a low and high octane timing map in place this will never be an issue with swings as wide as E15-E98.

BTW, E98 is as pure as you can get without it being chemical grade, The other 2% is cut with either a lubricant or a high quality race gas which is usually unknown, nobody has pure ethanol, at least not in a car. ^__^

[Payam@BMS]

So far so good here. 50/50 mix hasn't shown any ill effects YET.

Woahhh, you're doing 50/50 mix too? e47

[e90n52b30]

I think you're only issue is the ethanol deteriorating fuel lines. I know vehicles that run strictly E85, use special fuel lines. If you convert an engine to run on E85, you're suppose to swap out those gas lines.

[Sticky]

I think you're only issue is the ethanol deteriorating fuel lines. I know vehicles that run strictly E85, use special fuel lines. If you convert an engine to run on E85, you're suppose to swap out those gas lines.

Yep I think the fuel tank maybe as well needs to be lined?

[undercoverangie]

Yep I think the fuel tank maybe as well needs to be lined?

It depends on the material of the gas tank.... I can't see why a modern plastic gas tank would need to be lined. And a steel tank, as long as Ethanol is not stored in it for an extend period of time, the should not be a problem. You should never store a car with ethanol in it, t being very corrosive will hurt even ethanol compatible material.

[RnmEvo9]

I think you're only issue is the ethanol deteriorating fuel lines. I know vehicles that run strictly E85, use special fuel lines. If you convert an engine to run on E85, you're suppose to swap out those gas lines.

On my former Evo9, all I needed to run strictly E85 was a fuel pump and larger flowing 1000cc injectors. Everything else was OEM and the car was a total animal compared to when it ran strictly 93 octane.

FWIW, I've have been running 50/50 mixes on my 135i for well over a year with both JB4 and Cobb and I haven't had any issues whatsoever. I can't wait to test out this OTS E30 map from Cobb at the dragstrip since on Stage 2+ I only did a 12.3@117mph.