Results 1 to 25 of 169
-
05-25-2014, 01:07 PM #1
Guest Vendor
- Join Date
- Aug 2012
- Location
- Hayward, CA
- Posts
- 9,218
- Rep Points
- 3,666.1
- Mentioned
- 349 Post(s)
- Rep Power
- 0
VTT "Shotgun" HPFP upgrade announcement, 558WHP / 612WTQ Stage 2
We are happy to announce the VTT "Shotgun" HPFP upgrade kits for the N54 platform. This kit has been a long time in the making and after almost 3 months of daily testing we are finally happy with its consistency / reliability, and are ready to announce the product. We took the car to the dyno on Thursday to provide some numbers as well as logs to go along with those numbers so you can see the pronounced effect E85 can have on these engines. The results were nothing less than shocking and I think you will agree this upgrade is really going to open up the platform.
So let’s start out with the product descriptions and details. We are going to have 2 variations of the kit one for people on stock frames making anywhere from 400-550WHP, then one for people on stage 3 or single style turbos for 550whp+.
Product Description:
The first option is our "Single Barrel" kit; this kit is basically a HPFP relocation and overdrive kit. You take your existing HPFP, remove it, and using our mounting system, mount it in the accessory cluster to be driven by the belt. This allows the pump to be over driven, coupled with our new feed line, and rail modification this provides enough fuel for around 550WHP on 100% E85, with blends it can support even higher. We went through numerous pulley designs to find the optimum overdrive speed; too fast it would actually hurt fuel flow, and too slow would also hurt fuel flow.
Included in the "Single Barrel" kit:
- VTT Billet HPFP drive housing
- VTT Billet Stainless Steel drive shaft (pre-assembled in housing)
- High speed German ball bearings rated at 17,000RPM (pre-assembled in housing)
- VTT Billet HPFP pulley
- VTT HPFP housing mounting bracket
- VTT Billet stock location HPFP block off plate
- VTT High Pressure feed line
- VTT Low Pressure feed adaptor
- Properly sized drill bit to modify stock fuel rail (this can be done by any shop)
- Water line modification parts
- Plug and Play wiring harness
- All hardware required for assembly
Pricing for the "Single Barrel" kit is $1199 without new pump $1549 with.
Next we move on to our "Double Barrel" kit. Our Double barrel kit adds a second HPFP to your existing HPFP system. Using the same mounting system as our "Single Barrel" Kit, you now leave your stock HPFP in place and mount an additional pump on the accessory drive, then using our custom high / low pressure feed lines, modified fuel rail, and activation system, the second pump is now run on demand, and that demand can be user adjusted for activation point, and fuel added.
Included in the "Double Barrel" Kit:
- VTT Billet HPFP drive housing
- VTT Billet Stainless Steel drive shaft (pre-assembled in housing)
- High speed German ball bearings rated at 17,000RPM (pre-assembled in housing)
- VTT Billet HPFP pulley
- VTT HPFP housing mounting bracket
- VTT High Pressure feed lines with all fittings
- VTT High Pressure check valve with pre-assembled high pressure fittings
- VTT Low Pressure feed lines
- VTT LPFP pre-assembled "Y" fitting adaptor and lines
- VTT "Double Barrel" modified fuel rail (core charge applies)
- Water line modification parts
- VTT HPFP activation system
- Plug and play wiring harness for pumps
- Wiring harness for activation system
- All hardware required for assembly
Pricing for the "Double Barrel" kit is $1599 (without new pump) $1949 (with new pump)
Installation:
I am sure everyone is curious how hard the kit is to install, what has to be modified etc., we did our best to keep the kit very passive meaning it would be easy to return your vehicle back to stock with little effort, in order to mount the pump in the new location, you have to modify one water line, and bend an AC line out of the way, that’s all the modifications required everything else is bolt on, or off. If you choose to go back to stock at any point, you can purchase the modified water line from BMW and replace it.
For the "Single Barrel" kit, installation requires intake manifold removal, stock HPFP removal, stock high pressure feed line removal, installing HPFP block off plate, unbolting and rerouting the LPFP line to where the pump will now run, plugging in the plug extension, reinstalling intake manifold, remove charge pipe, remove cooling fan, unbolt 2 bolts from drivers side motor mount, jack up driver side of motor to allow easier access to AC compressor, remove 3 bolts holding AC compressor, install mounting bracket in place over the AC compressor and install new bolts securing in place, follow supplied instructions to modify water line to clear pulley, lower motor back down install bolts, install HPFP to housing, reroute LPFP feed to HPFP and connect, install new belt on system, reinstall fan, remove stock fuel rail, install modified rail, install high pressure feed line from HPFP to rail, reinstall charge pipe, reinstall intake, purge system, and start vehicle. I can install the system in under 2 hours, but I have done it many times, for a first time I would suggest 4 hours for a shop, 5-6 hours for a person at home.
For the "Double Barrel" system Same as above, except stock pump stays in place, another high pressure feed line, high pressure check valve, and another high pressure connection to the rail, as well as different LPFP routing, and a little more wiring. I would say “Double Barrel" 4-5 hours for a shop 6-7 for a someone trying at home.
Let’s get into some of the testing and numbers
Testing:
We have done extensive testing over the past 3 months, and during this time have learned quite a bit about the HPFP system.
We will start with some logs on 100% E85 and the completely stock HPFP system in place EXCEPT we did use a modified fuel rail as it was all we had ( spoiler alert, it didn’t matter), this was done with a brand new HPFP installed just for these tests.
The first one is OTS HPFP Req and OTS AFR levels on a mild tune we used for most of our testing, you can see the HPFP just nose dives almost instantly when trying to make these runs on 100% E85 even on a mild tune
Datazap log: http://www.datazap.me/u/vtt-shotgun-...12&zoom=79-138
Next one is same tune, just 2500 Req and leaner AFR levels, some people have pushed the theory that asking the DME to request more HPFP pressure will help the HPFP deliver more fuel, this not the case, and you are just putting unneeded strain on the HPFP system for no gains, you always want to run as little HPFP as possible to provide the fuel you need as the higher the pressure the more strain you are putting on the entire system
Datazap log:http://www.datazap.me/u/vtt-shotgun-...2&zoom=142-276
Next one is same tune with 2500 Req and OTS fuel, again same thing HPFP just nose dives instantly
Datazap log: http://www.datazap.me/u/vtt-shotgun-...12&zoom=49-107
Ok now we have a "Single Barrel" log on 100% E85 a MUCH more aggressive tune (it’s actually the same tune we made 523WHP / 541WTQ on) You can see the HPFP holds almost perfectly the entire time except that small blip at low RPM. This log is also a 3-4 shift wot almost to redline in 4th for maximun load and fueling needs, you can see the whole log in the link below to see how the "Single Barrel" does on the shift
Datazap log: http://www.datazap.me/u/vtt-shotgun-...15&zoom=43-248
Moving on to the dyno day.
Dyno:
Let’s start with a Disclaimer here, these numbers were realized with a no holds barred, break my turbos I don't care tune, pushing 27 psi mid-range and just holding as much WGDC as we could up top, if you ran this on the street your stock frames would most likely no last very long at all. This dyno session honestly had nothing to do with numbers it had to do with pushing as hard as we could on the stock frames to see what the HPFP upgrade could handle, that we realized a new stock motor / stock frame turbo N54 peak WHP, and scored big numbers was a nice bonus. FYI Dzenno will promptly send all emails to trash asking for these tunes...
Modification break down:
Completely Stock N54 engine
Stock head
VTT "Double Barrel" HPFP upgrade
LPFP Walbro 450 in bucket to 450 Walbro inline
VTT Stage 2 Billet turbochargers
Cobb V3 AP flash tuning
Tune by PTF
Cobb FMIC
BMS DP's
CP-E charge pipe with Tial BOV
BMS DCI
100% E85 NO METH
For the dyno session we ran the "Double Barrel" set up the entire time for safety reasons, and did a total of 6 runs. Dzenno was very busy and was able to squeeze an hour in to get these results, and as always he is the MAN when it comes to N54 tuning. First log and graph is literally pulling onto the dyno using the same tune we had been testing with for the past 2 weeks, strapping down, and firing off a run. Log shows zero timing corrections and HPFP is holding perfectly.
1st run: 523WHP / 541WTQ.
Datazap log: http://www.datazap.me/u/vtt-shotgun-...og=0&data=3-15
2nd run: 539WHP / 559WTQ - Added a little boost and timing, again log shows zero corrections and HPFP is holding fine
Datazap log: http://www.datazap.me/u/vtt-shotgun-...og=1&data=3-15
3rd run: 542WHP / 571WTQ - Again little boost and timing
Datazaplog: http://www.datazap.me/u/vtt-shotgun-...og=2&data=3-15
4th run: 547WHP / 582WTQ - More of the same
Datazap log: http://www.datazap.me/u/vtt-shotgun-...og=0&data=3-15
5th run: 547WHP / 584WTQ - Very slight changes to boost only
Datazap log: http://www.datazap.me/u/vtt-shotgun-...og=1&data=3-15
6th run: 558WHP / 619WTQ - Same map as 5th run, just full cool down, and 5th gear pull
Datazap log: http://www.datazap.me/u/vtt-shotgun-...og=2&data=3-15
If you look in the logs you will see from run to run, the HPFP curve will vary slightly sometimes dropping slightly below Req, sometimes holding slightly above it, this is normal as even with the activation system adding fuel from the second pump the DME is still controlling the show and this is how we wanted it. Every run is different and the DME adjusts as it sees fit. If we wanted to really crank boost to 28-30 PSI in the mid-range we prob could have made 630-640WTQ and 560-570WHP but the gains up top started to flatten out, so there was no point to push the motor past this point.
We have included every dyno file, log, graph, and jpeg in a zip attached to this post, feel free to analyze to your hearts content.
Here are a few of pictures of the prototype housing, shaft, and pulley
Prototype pictures:
Let’s answer a few questions some people might have.
Q & A:
Q: Will this set up work for me if have stock turbos and just want to run E85 without worrying about mixing?
A: 100% you can pull up to the pump, fill up with E85, and not worry about running out of fuel with as much power as you can possibly make with stock turbos, this also applies to upgraded stock frames such as our Stage 1-2, and RB turbos
Q: What happens if the HPFP fails will I be stranded?
A: Good question, the answer is no, the way BMW has set up this HPFP system is, even if the HPFP fails the LPFP will bypass through the pump and you can limp the car home. We actually unplugged the "Single Barrel" system and drove the car for 30 miles with no issues except a limp condition and low power
Q: What if the belt breaks or comes off, I will be stranded then right, because the pump isn't turning?
A: Again no, with the way BMW has set up the system as long as you have steady LPFP even with the HPFP not turning at all, you can limp the car home. How do we know this, well we went as far as to remove the belt from the car and drive it for a few miles with no power steering or charging, it drove just fine on the LPFP fuel only with no HPFP rotation. We did our best to leave no stone unturned
Q: Can I run mixes of E85 and pump fuel with this set up?
A: Absolutely, this will actually raise the amount of fuel the "shotgun" system can supply as it requires approximately 30% more volume to run E85.
Q: What if I take a trip and there is no E85 near me, can I use just regular pump gas with the "Shotgun" system?
A: Again absolutely, the system is 100% compatible with gas or Ethanol (E85), and will work perfectly with either fuel, or any combination of both.
Q: Have you found out exactly how much WHP the "Double Barrel" can support on 100% E85
A: We have not, we will be testing on our stage 3 system soon, the numbers we just made showed no signs of taxing the system at all, and this is with the system only adding a small amount of fuel
Q: How long until I can have this kit on my car, I want to run 100% E85!!
A: All testing is finalized, all Cad drawings are finalized, we should enter production quickly, and we anticipate having kits in stock ready to ship in 3 months, this is an estimate not a promise
Q: I assume this upgrade is going to be very popular, how many kits do you plan on producing, and is there a way to get on a waiting list to avoid missing out on the first run, if so how does it work?
A: For the first run we plan on producing 50-100 kits, we will be taking pre-orders starting next week for people that want to insure they get a spot. To get on the waiting list, you need to send a direct email to [email protected] or [email protected] with "Shotgun Preorder" in the subject line, there will be a non-refundable deposit required to hold a spot.
We appreciate all your patience while we worked out the bugs in the system and look forward to pushing the platform! Please do not hesitate to drop us an email if you have other questions or type them below and we will answer them as best we can.
Last edited by Tony@VargasTurboTech; 12-19-2014 at 07:11 PM.
-
05-25-2014, 01:17 PM #2
-
05-25-2014, 01:19 PM #3
LEGIT ..... and in the mean time you broke stock frame record , no ?
09 6AT 335i Coupe M-Sport - SOLD
Current - 16 Jeep Wrangler - Few Mods
Looking for a n54 project e90/e82
-
05-25-2014, 01:22 PM #4
Timeout
- Join Date
- Mar 2010
- Location
- AZ
- Posts
- 2,826
- Mentioned
- 43 Post(s)
- Rep Power
- 0
-
05-25-2014, 01:32 PM #5
Guest Vendor
- Join Date
- Aug 2012
- Location
- Hayward, CA
- Posts
- 9,218
- Rep Points
- 3,666.1
- Mentioned
- 349 Post(s)
- Rep Power
- 0
We did, but its hard to say for sure because Dzenno was on different gearing do pulls in different gears. But its safe to say his ported head was helping so we think yes we would have the 100% stock motor including head record. That's honestly not why we posted the numbers, we wanted to show exactly how capable the system and motor are on 100% E85. We think they show that.
-
05-25-2014, 01:35 PM #6
-
05-25-2014, 01:41 PM #7
Member
- Join Date
- Dec 2012
- Location
- IL
- Posts
- 258
- Rep Points
- 256.3
- Mentioned
- 17 Post(s)
- Rep Power
- 3
Is there even more capacity if I already have your v.1 hpfp and modified rail? This will compliment we'll with the stage 3 kit.
Titanium Silver E92 09 BMW 335i xdrive 6AT
KW V3 coilovers, AMS FMIC, AR Catless DP, Walbro 455 LPFP, BMS DCI, Alpina B3 Trans Flash, Vargas HPFP and Rail
Protuned via Cobb by JR TUNED @ PandL Motorsports
75%E85/25%93 blend 430awhp/470lbs tq on AWD Dynojet
Dyno Video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iE6Ed...ature=youtu.be
-
05-25-2014, 01:42 PM #8
Member
- Join Date
- Feb 2010
- Posts
- 25
- Rep Points
- 72.3
- Mentioned
- 0 Post(s)
- Rep Power
- 0
Finally the n54 can be pushed to the limits.
What I really want to see is what can a single turbo/ stage 3 twin on e85 can do
-
05-25-2014, 01:43 PM #9
This is so awesome. Benefits everyone from stock frames to custom singles to big twins.
[I]E88 N54 w stuff
MB w205 c450
-
05-25-2014, 01:43 PM #10
Timeout
- Join Date
- Mar 2010
- Location
- AZ
- Posts
- 2,826
- Mentioned
- 43 Post(s)
- Rep Power
- 0
-
05-25-2014, 01:47 PM #11
Member
- Join Date
- Dec 2012
- Location
- Florida
- Posts
- 1,613
- Rep Points
- 3,270.5
- Mentioned
- 125 Post(s)
- Rep Power
- 33
Awesome name awesome product awesome numbers. Good job, this is the proper answer. How are you controlling the second pump turn on?
-
05-25-2014, 01:52 PM #12
Awesome work Tony! Option 1 looks very sexy for someone running pump gas and a big turbo
MOTIV750, MOTIV P-1000 PI, MOTIV/FUEL-IT! low pressure fuel system, AEM EMS/COBB AP, Aquamist HFS-3, ETS FMIC, SPEC stage 3+ clutch/SS flywheel, BC Racing coilovers and VMR wheels wrapped in Hankook RS3s.
-
05-25-2014, 01:55 PM #13
Guest Vendor
- Join Date
- Aug 2012
- Location
- Hayward, CA
- Posts
- 9,218
- Rep Points
- 3,666.1
- Mentioned
- 349 Post(s)
- Rep Power
- 0
You will have no additional capacity but you will get a slight benefit cost wise as you will not need to pay the rail core if you get a "Single Barrel" kit as the rail mods are the same. For the "Double Barrel" kit it wont matter as the rail has more modifications to accept the second feed line.
-
05-25-2014, 01:58 PM #14
Guest Vendor
- Join Date
- Aug 2012
- Location
- Hayward, CA
- Posts
- 9,218
- Rep Points
- 3,666.1
- Mentioned
- 349 Post(s)
- Rep Power
- 0
It is controlled via a user adjustable RPM switch, and you can vary voltage with different modules to have the FSV supply more or less fuel. For our flash car we do this with external controllers, it would seem possible @Terry@BMS could add an output to the JB's that is RPM activated with varying voltages but I do not know enough about his system to say yes or no for certain, that is something he can comment on. If so then the "Double Barrel" would come in two options one for flash only cars, and one for Piggy cars, with the piggy version being slightly cheaper as we would not need to include the activation system.
Last edited by Tony@VargasTurboTech; 05-25-2014 at 05:22 PM.
-
05-25-2014, 02:00 PM #15
Awesome product Tony. Glad we finally have a working solution to our fueling problems. Now we gotta add this onto some 700+ whp n54's and just keep going till she blows!
Burger Motorsports
Home of the Worlds fastest N20s, N54s, N55s, S55s, N63s, and S63s!
It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
-
05-25-2014, 02:09 PM #16
Member
- Join Date
- Apr 2011
- Location
- Jersey City
- Posts
- 3,850
- Rep Points
- 3,654.6
- Mentioned
- 75 Post(s)
- Rep Power
- 37
Great progress for the n54. Nice work! Now I want to see some big power n54's!
ESS 6XX kit
-
05-25-2014, 02:10 PM #17
Timeout
- Join Date
- Mar 2010
- Location
- AZ
- Posts
- 2,826
- Mentioned
- 43 Post(s)
- Rep Power
- 0
I'm $#@!ing stoked to see the stage 3 plus this! Tony. Take one for the team. 1000 WHP. Buy bigger turbos nao then hit the track. In your configuration, what do you think the turbos can flow to?
EDIT: Its still the weekend, did you girl leave you yet?
-
05-25-2014, 02:10 PM #18
Timeout
- Join Date
- Feb 2012
- Location
- Naples, FL
- Posts
- 2,085
- Rep Points
- 2,211.2
- Mentioned
- 73 Post(s)
- Rep Power
- 0
-
05-25-2014, 02:32 PM #19
Wow good stuff man. Another mod on my list.... Spec 2+ clutch > Meth Kit > LSD > Shotgun HPFP . Maybe I should move this one up a spot. lol
08 535i 6MT - JB4 G5 ISO - Luke performance flash - E40 & BMS 100% Meth - AR design catless DP - ETS 5" intercooler - BMS DCI - BMS OCC - ER chargepipe - HKS BOV - K-sport coilovers - UUC evo SSK - CDV deleted - ACS spoiler -
-
05-25-2014, 02:34 PM #20
Guest Vendor
- Join Date
- Aug 2012
- Location
- Hayward, CA
- Posts
- 9,218
- Rep Points
- 3,666.1
- Mentioned
- 349 Post(s)
- Rep Power
- 0
-
05-25-2014, 02:40 PM #21
Timeout
- Join Date
- Mar 2010
- Location
- AZ
- Posts
- 2,826
- Mentioned
- 43 Post(s)
- Rep Power
- 0
-
05-25-2014, 03:07 PM #22
Member
- Join Date
- Nov 2012
- Location
- Florida
- Posts
- 1,228
- Rep Points
- 1,085.8
- Mentioned
- 33 Post(s)
- Rep Power
- 11
-
05-25-2014, 03:14 PM #2308 535i 6MT - JB4 G5 ISO - Luke performance flash - E40 & BMS 100% Meth - AR design catless DP - ETS 5" intercooler - BMS DCI - BMS OCC - ER chargepipe - HKS BOV - K-sport coilovers - UUC evo SSK - CDV deleted - ACS spoiler -
-
05-25-2014, 03:21 PM #24
Guest Vendor
- Join Date
- Aug 2012
- Location
- Hayward, CA
- Posts
- 9,218
- Rep Points
- 3,666.1
- Mentioned
- 349 Post(s)
- Rep Power
- 0
You will 100% need a solid LPFP option in the tank, the stock pump will not cut it. All these tests were done on a Walbro 450 in bucket, to a Walbro 450 inline. @SteveAZ believes this is actually a very inefficient set up, and even then it provided plenty of fuel, we will be going to dual 450's parallel in bucket working with Steve on this, we think this will be a solid set up for 600WHP+ up to a point. For the "Single Barrel" kits, I think a stock pump to 255 inline should be fine. Once we start really pushing big WHP numbers on 100% E85 its very possible the stock LPFP system from regulator to hoses may no longer be sufficient even with twin 450's in tank, at that point going to a return style system will be required, but thats something to talk about once it becomes required.
-
05-25-2014, 03:40 PM #25
Member
- Join Date
- Feb 2014
- Location
- North Miami Beach
- Posts
- 42
- Rep Points
- 82.1
- Mentioned
- 0 Post(s)
- Rep Power
- 0
@VargasTurboTech. It is going to be a long summer waiting for the Stage 2 Shotgun Kits, exactly when will we be able to send our deposit money!? Congrats to you and your team for another milestone development for the N54 platform. Looking forward to seeing what your stage two and three turbo kits will accomplish with these Shotgun HPFPs providing the 100% E85 fuel support needed. No more mixing!
Welcome to a...
We welcome Dantttyy