AFE Mach Force downpipe for N55

[TeamErc]

Hello, new to the forum (any forum for that matter) so please let me know if I am not posting improperly for any reason.

I just purchased a 2011 335i, m-sport 6m and then ordered an AFE Mach Force downpipe. I was looking for any experience with this downpipe. Quality of pipe, installation, sound, etc. I plan on installing myself over the weekend (hopefully comes on time) but another thread I read on installing on an xi (n54 also) seemed pretty difficult. Do you have to drop the sub-frame on a rear drive n55 also?

I have a dyno scheduled for tomorrow to get a baseline before putting the jb4 stage 2 back on and the new downpipe. The car had the jb4 on it when I purchased the car but I removed it to get the car inspected and the battery cable recall take care of at the local dealer.

Also wondering if the resonance chamber actually helps drone or marketing hype.

[Sticky]

You're the first person I know of with this pipe on the N55 here.

I'm looking forward to your dyno numbers.

[TeamErc]

OK. Didn't get my downpipe in time for the weekend but did get the baseline dyno done. I am considering having a shop instal anyway after reading some spooky posts about installing. The Dyno was performed on a dynopack with no TCF factor. Looking for feedback on how this fairs with another base setup dyno's others have seen. Well, the only mod at this point was the AFE cold air induction as seen in pics.

I was expecting around 275 HP and 320 TQ from stock setup just from various information I have gathered on posts, however, I understand dynopack read about 5-7% higher than dynojet due to advantage of the hub measuring setup vs rollers adding friction and weight of wheel tire setup. That would then make sense to me on HP number (280\.95 and give air induction some credit getting to a =299 SAE HP reading).

To me the surprise was the torque at 302 FT LB SAE. After correcting .05% to comparable dynajet #'s (not exact science I know) 285tq. Lower than expected.

Other important notes are that I was running 93 octain but the weather was upper 80's with almost 100 humidity. Not sure if the weather makes that much difference or if the SAE numbers compensate for that.

Any thoughts would be appreciated. My comments above are only my thoughts on what I was expecting and my logic (could be quite flawed). That is why I am looking for feedback. Just be nice.

I also understand it is more about the comparisons in the numbers after upgrades using same dyno, not trying to compare one dyno to another. Not looking to spark that debate either.

Thanks

[Sticky]

You got the baseline done though, that's important.

[TeamErc]

I took my car for a new dyno yesterday after installing the JB4 back on the car. Torque went from 300ftlb at back wheels to 370ftlb and horsepower went from 300hp to 335hp, in round numbers. This is only in map 1, mostly. The blue line, if you can see it was in map 2. Its the line that held the torque curve out the longest and the smoothest HP line. The ecu didnt have a chance to adjust to the new mapping so wasnt expecting much change. Looks pretty good though, the power curves have quite a bit of area in between them throughout the power band. (FYI, don't let the title at the top of the dyno fool you, my car is a rear drive 335i m-sport.)

Next change will be the catless downpipe but the performance shop showed me an issue with the build (see below). I am going to return and get a new one before installing.



Downpipe looks great but pipe was not drilled out where resonance chamber was welded onto the pipe. See impages. Notice the small pilot hole but not drilled out. Also notice the larger circle where you can see where resonance chamber was welded. I just emailed turner this morning. I dont expect this to be an issue. Hopefully they just send a new pipe out.

[Sticky]

I took my car for a new dyno yesterday after installing the JB4 back on the car. Torque went from 300ftlb at back wheels to 370ftlb and horsepower went from 300hp to 335hp, in round numbers. This is only in map 1, mostly. The blue line, if you can see it was in map 2. Its the line that held the torque curve out the longest and the smoothest HP line. The ecu didnt have a chance to adjust to the new mapping so wasnt expecting much change. Looks pretty good though, the power curves have quite a bit of area in between them throughout the power band. (FYI, don't let the title at the top of the dyno fool you, my car is a rear drive 335i m-sport.)

Next change will be the catless downpipe but the performance shop showed me an issue with the build (see below). I am going to return and get a new one before installing.



Downpipe looks great but pipe was not drilled out where resonance chamber was welded onto the pipe. See impages. Notice the small pilot hole but not drilled out. Also notice the larger circle where you can see where resonance chamber was welded. I just emailed turner this morning. I dont expect this to be an issue. Hopefully they just send a new pipe out.

Great update man! Would be nice to have a bigger graph buy regardless good photos and details. Your car should feel much stronger now.

[N55Bimmer335i]

TeamErc,

Seeing pictures of what was until this month my car is strange to say the least. I think you can say with out hesitation, she was well taken care of. Since my Disability has worsened and the clutch became a problem for me - I had to part with by far the Best Car I ever owned. Take car of my Baby. Have you passed 10K on the odometer?

I could not afford another BMW - new so instead I bought a low mileage 2009 Mercedes C63 AMG. On Weds this week will be the first time I join the 500+ HP group. Just sent my ECU to Modern Horsepower, Crank Ratings are 545hp and 504tq. The problem with this car is the massive loss thru the 7sp Automatic Tranny

Best of Luck to you N. - Your a good man.

[N55Bimmer335i]

To TeamErc

You had asked me which DP I had ordered, and I told you I could not remember. I was just looking through messages in my profile and came across the Downpipe I had and then sold it was an N55 AR Downpipe. They also had a Catted Version with a large pass thru

I should have the papers you need on Thursday (That's the latest news on them I have)

Matt

[Sticky]

I could not afford another BMW - new so instead I bought a low mileage 2009 Mercedes C63 AMG.

I don't understand, the C63 is cheaper how than a low mileage BMW?

Just sent my ECU to Modern Horsepower

Why?

[N55Bimmer335i]

Sticky,

You know you bring up a good point.

Sure I could have purchased a low mileage BMW, There are 3 things I needed in another car, 1 - The Seat has to fit my back, 2 - It needs to have power and easily upgradable, 3 - I wanted one where the Dealer was closer than 75+ miles. Where I live there are not any BMW Dealers on my side of Maryland. There is however a Benz dealer 6 miles away. The car I purchased has a warranty that goes to 10/2014. With past experience owning a Mercedes, it was the better choice geographically. TeamErc who bought my 335i, has a dealer very close, as the car only had 9400 miles on it. It was a perfect car for him, and the MB a good choice for me.

The ECU was sent out for a performance update of MHP S1-- 545HP/502lb/ft Gains of 94HP/59lb/ft Over Stock (v3 CDT)

[Sticky]

Sticky,

You know you bring up a good point.

Sure I could have purchased a low mileage BMW, There are 3 things I needed in another car, 1 - The Seat has to fit my back, 2 - It needs to have power and easily upgradable, 3 - I wanted one where the Dealer was closer than 75+ miles. Where I live there are not any BMW Dealers on my side of Maryland. There is however a Benz dealer 6 miles away. The car I purchased has a warranty that goes to 10/2014. With past experience owning a Mercedes, it was the better choice geographically. TeamErc who bought my 335i, has a dealer very close, as the car only had 9400 miles on it. It was a perfect car for him, and the MB a good choice for me.

The ECU was sent out for a performance update of MHP S1-- 545HP/502lb/ft Gains of 94HP/59lb/ft Over Stock (v3 CDT)

You sent your ECU to the wrong tuner: http://www.benzboost.com/showthread....-another-tuner

Create a thread on your car when you get a chance.

[TeamErc]

Turner motorsport did not have much experience with the AFE so I just returned for money back. I am now investigating again which downpipe I want if not the AFE. I will be happy with the mods I have plus a downpipe (350-400 HP would be nice). Maybe meth one day. Looking at the BMS but not sure about the 3.5 inch if that is big enough but don't want a 5" as I thought that could create turbulence issues with a lower HP lightly modified vehicle. I hear people putting out 600+ hp with 4" pipes. Search continues.

[TeamErc]

Well, after several conversations between Turner and AFE, the verdict on my original downpipe is that the hole that "we" (Turner and my local tuner thought the same before I returned the pipe) thought was a pilot hole is the correctly drilled hole. AFE explained to Turner that the small hole was a result of several tests with different size holes that yielded the best result in dampening the resonance or droning effect with the resonance chamber tube.

Turner has sent the downpipe back and I am awaiting its return. Looks like we are in a go ahead status with the AFE Mach Force downpipe again once a receive it back, and have my first emissions test. (Hopefully I receive the emissions notice for that soon now that the car is finally tagged properly) For those of you that don't know, emission testing in MD is once every two years and you usually get a notice right away when you purchase a used car. So it makes sense to wait.

[TeamErc]

Just a quick update on the post. I will follow up with some picks but the AFE Mach Force downpipe was sent back to me and I finally installed in January. Then, in March, I finally got around to getting another dyno done.

Results: (numbers are at hub-dynopak)
map 1 - marginal difference from 370 ft lb trq 335 hp from last dyno without downpipe
map 2 - with downpipe and changed to map 2, hit 390 ft lb trq and 370 hp
map 5 (autotune) - with downpipe, just under targeted 400 ft lb trq (397) and 365 hp.

That is about 100 ftlb trq and 70 hp gains over stock setup (stock except for cold air induction)

Note:tests on rainy day, very wet air in open garage. Sure that impacts numbers slightly.

Of course, added benefit of downpipe is that car sounds incredible. Happy with power output but every now and again getting limp mode??? Mostly when just cruising, never under full throttle.

Now turning back to braking and handling. Just had AP racing 6 piston front and 4 piston rear big brake kit installed, and new breyton gts-r black wheels installed. Looking forward to get back to some autoxing. See some of you out with BMW CCA North Capital Chapter.

PS.. n55bimmer335i, over 15k miles on the odo now.

[Sticky]

Just a quick update on the post. I will follow up with some picks but the AFE Mach Force downpipe was sent back to me and I finally installed in January. Then, in March, I finally got around to getting another dyno done.

Results: (numbers are at hub-dynopak)
map 1 - marginal difference from 370 ft lb trq 335 hp from last dyno without downpipe
map 2 - with downpipe and changed to map 2, hit 390 ft lb trq and 370 hp
map 5 (autotune) - with downpipe, just under targeted 400 ft lb trq (397) and 365 hp.

That is about 100 ftlb trq and 70 hp gains over stock setup (stock except for cold air induction)

Note:tests on rainy day, very wet air in open garage. Sure that impacts numbers slightly.

Of course, added benefit of downpipe is that car sounds incredible. Happy with power output but every now and again getting limp mode??? Mostly when just cruising, never under full throttle.

Now turning back to braking and handling. Just had AP racing 6 piston front and 4 piston rear big brake kit installed, and new breyton gts-r black wheels installed. Looking forward to get back to some autoxing. See some of you out with BMW CCA North Capital Chapter.

PS.. n55bimmer335i, over 15k miles on the odo now.

You don't have the graphs?

[TeamErc]

Your right sticky, should not post without backup. I was just trying to get an update posted when I had the time but turns out that my memory was not serving me well. Below post has graphs and a summary of dyno's. Note, all below dyno's on same dynopak dyno. There are four graphs included. The first two are self explanatory, the second two are showing all 8 runs that day. They are hard to read but I wanted to include and try and point out a couple things.

Previous results (late summer 2013)
1) Baseline - 300/300 tq/hp - No JB4, mostly stock except for AFE intake.
2) JB4 map1 - 370/335 tq/hp

Recent results (March 2014) - pulled 8 dyno's. two on map 1, four on map 2, two on map 5. (conditions rainy 60 deg)
3) JB4 map 1 with DP, 365/320 tq/hp. I ran this dyno to compare the test last summer with jb4 map1 without dp. Power was down from summer without a downpipe (because wet air???). Also, shop realized they forgot to setup fans for air intake until both map1 and the first two of the map 2 runs were done. Graph - On TQ and HP graphs with 8 runs, the bottom red and green lines.
4) JB4 map 2 with DP, 395/350 tq/hp. The last two map 2 runs (with fans setup) were strong on torque (light blue and top purple were last two runs). Notice how fast tq builds on these two runs.
5) JB4 map 5 (auto tune) with DP, 381/353 tq/hp. On TQ and HP graphs with 8 runs, first run top red and second run top green lines. Hopefully you will notice, if you can see the tq graph clear enough, the torque on the auto tune doesn't peek as early as the map 2, holds the torque more constant until 4,000 rpm. Also, notice on the HP graph that auto tune seemed to allow the HP to build a little longer in the RPM range.

All in all, my take away is that if I want the most torque, map 2 is the way to go, however, map 5 seems usable as the torque curve is high and more broad, while resulting in highest HP in the highest RPM's. Since I had map 2 cause limp mode twice in the last 4 months or so, I decided to give auto tune a try for a while. Then it too kicked into limp mode two weeks ago.

[Sticky]

Map 2 or 5 but looks like Map 2 is the way to go. That's a solid gain from your baseline.

I don't know if you just intend to run the JB4 but I have a Cobb AP that works for your car.

[rwalker]

Previous results (late summer 2013)
1) Baseline - 300/300 tq/hp - No JB4, mostly stock except for AFE intake.
2) JB4 map1 - 370/335 tq/hp

Recent results (March 2014) - pulled 8 dyno's. two on map 1, four on map 2, two on map 5. (conditions rainy 60 deg)
3) JB4 map 1 with DP, 365/320 tq/hp. I ran this dyno to compare the test last summer with jb4 map1 without dp. Power was down from summer without a downpipe (because wet air???). Also, shop realized they forgot to setup fans for air intake until both map1 and the first two of the map 2 runs were done. Graph - On TQ and HP graphs with 8 runs, the bottom red and green lines.
4) JB4 map 2 with DP, 395/350 tq/hp. The last two map 2 runs (with fans setup) were strong on torque (light blue and top purple were last two runs). Notice how fast tq builds on these two runs.
5) JB4 map 5 (auto tune) with DP, 381/353 tq/hp. On TQ and HP graphs with 8 runs, first run top red and second run top green lines. Hopefully you will notice, if you can see the tq graph clear enough, the torque on the auto tune doesn't peek as early as the map 2, holds the torque more constant until 4,000 rpm. Also, notice on the HP graph that auto tune seemed to allow the HP to build a little longer in the RPM range.

What octane?

[TeamErc]

Sticky, I am nervous about why I am getting thrown into limp mode more frequently than I am comfortable with. Is your cob unit uses, what version?

rwalker, 93 octane.

[Sticky]

Sticky, I am nervous about why I am getting thrown into limp mode more frequently than I am comfortable with. Is your cob unit uses, what version?

rwalker, 93 octane.

Not sure what you mean? I don't use the Cobb unit myself.